With all the studies which we have done to refute Zionism (that is, the alleged right of the Jewish people to have a homeland in the Middle East) and to demonstrate that the Jews who reject Jesus Christ are not God’s chosen people, it is still good to have a reference to quickly and effectively prove these things.  

The following is a summary of a recent conversation I’ve seen which accomplishes this.  You can use this as a reference tool when you encounter someone who is promoting Zionism and saying that the Jewish people are God’s chosen people or if someone asks you about the topic.

I will keep the verse numbers in the Bible references. 

I will also include the questions asked in between the reading of the Bible passages at the point they were asked in the conversation I am copying out here.

First, the Zionist claims that the land which was formerly called Canaan is the Jews’ land (she means it is theirs unconditionally and that the Jews’ are its’ rightful possessors now and have never ceased to be its rightful possessors since they first conquered the land thousands of years ago under Joshua).

The man refuting Zionism then asks the pro-Zionist woman: “Would you say that they (the Jews) are still God’s chosen people?”

The pro-Zionist woman responds “Yes.”

The man refuting Zionism tells the pro-Zionist to open up her Bible and read Matthew 21:33-44.

“33 Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:

34 And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.

35 And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.

36 Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.

37 But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.

38 But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.

39 And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew (killed) him.

At this point the man refuting Zionism asks the woman about who this parable is about.  She understands it is about Israel; and the vinedressers (husbandmen) are Israel’s rulers.

The man refuting Zionism also points out that the Son being sent was the last chance of these vinedresser tenants to get right.  He asks the Pro-Zionist woman if that is correct.  She agrees.

The man refuting Zionism tells the woman to now read through verse 44 with the question in mind of “What is God going to do now that these tenants have killed His Son?”

40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?

41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.

42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord’s doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

At this point the man refuting Zionism asks the Pro-Zionist woman who the kingdom of God will be taken away from?  She correctly answers “From the Israelites.”

The man refuting Zionism then asks the woman: “So why would you say they’re God’s chosen people?  Where did you get that from?”

The woman can’t answer.

44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.”

The man refuting Zionism then goes on to say that he will show her the true Israel is, who the true Jews are (he means the true people of God).

He tells her to turn in her Bible to Matthew 8:10-13:

“10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.

11 And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and Jacob, in the kingdom of heaven.

12 But the children of the kingdom shall be cast out into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

13 And Jesus said unto the centurion, Go thy way; and as thou hast believed, so be it done unto thee. And his servant was healed in the selfsame hour.”

After the woman reads the passage, he asks her: “So the subjects of the kingdom were at the time the Jews (he means natural ethnic Jews), right?”

The woman replies “Yes.”

The man makes it known that this is showing that ethnic Jews who reject Jesus Christ will be cast into hell while gentiles who have a real faith in Jesus (like the centurion commended here for having greater faith than anyone in Israel) will enter the kingdom of God with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

The pro-Zionist woman says “Okay.”

The man refuting Zionism then has the woman read Romans 2:26-29:

“26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

It is established that God regards a physically uncircumcised gentile who keep God’s Law from his heart as a true Jew.

27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfill the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

It is established that a natural Jew who is physically circumcised is not in God’s favor if he breaks God’s law from his heart.

28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:

29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.”

It is established that a true Jew is one who follows the Lord’s Law from their heart and not just outwardly.  It is also established that to keep God’s law from the heart equals obeying/following Jesus Christ.  A true Jew is one who is circumcised spiritually and united to Jesus Christ.

The man refuting Zionism then asks the Pro-Zionist woman if she would be shocked to see that ethnic Jews who reject Jesus Christ are descendants (he means spiritual descendants) of Hagar (making them Ishmaelites).

The woman says “Yes, that would be huge.”

He then tells her to open up to and read Galatians 4:21-31:

“21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?

22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.

23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.

24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar (Hagar).

25 For this Agar (Hagar) is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.

The man refuting Zionism at this point asks the Pro-Zionist woman “Did you catch it?”  He goes on to say “Jerusalem on earth is Hagar” and then he asks the woman again if she caught that.

The Pro-Zionist woman admits: “Hagar stands for Mount Sinai and corresponds to the present city of Jerusalem.”

The man refuting Zionism makes it clear to the pro-Zionist woman that she is fighting for the land that is in bondage ,and which enslaves, as she is contending for the nation of Israel.  He then says “I didn’t say that, Paul just said that, right?” 

The woman admits, “Yeah.”

Then the man refuting Zionism brings up the question of “Who is the true Jerusalem and who are the true sons of Sarah (meaning the sons of promise; those in covenant with God?”  He tells the woman to keep reading.

26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.

28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.

Now the question is brought up “Who are the true children of promise as Isaac?”  Of course the answer is “True Christians.”  And then it is reiterated that the Jews who reject Jesus are sons of Hagar.

29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.

31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.”

The man refuting Zionism establishes again that the children of the bondwoman (the woman who is a slave) are the Jews.  Obviously then, Christians are to have no spiritual fellowship with Jews who reject Jesus Christ nor with those professing Christians who would try to bring Christians back under Judaism (that is the main issue which Paul was addressing in Galatians).  Jews who reject Jesus Christ also obviously have no inheritance in relation to the promises which God made to Abraham (because the blessing of Abraham is received in Isaac who was borne by Sarah; not in Ishmael who was borne by Hagar).

It is established then that the real Jerusalem, the one which God delights in, is above- in heaven.

Then the Pro-Zionist woman is told to read Hebrews 12:22-24:

“22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

It is emphasized that there is a Jerusalem in heaven; a Zion in heaven (Jerusalem and Zion are basically interchangeable terms).  That is the city of the living God.

23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

24 And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.”

The man refuting Zionism establishes definitely again that there is a city of God in heaven, the heavenly Jerusalem where God is, where an innumerable company of angels are, and where the faithful who have died are- and they’re having church there.

The man refuting Zionism also reminds the pro-Zionist woman at this point that Jesus said the kingdom of God would be taken away from the natural Jews, and that the city (earthly Jerusalem) and its Temple would be destroyed as a sign that God was done with them (and we know that this happened 40 years later in AD 70).

The man refuting Zionism then takes the woman to Revelation 21:1-4 to emphasize to her that Jerusalem which is in heaven will come down to earth.  It is not here yet.  When it comes down, God Himself will come down with it.

Revelation 21:1-4:

“And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.”

The man refuting Zionism then tells the pro-Zionist woman that he will now show her who the true offspring of Abraham are (my note here: he really already has- but this will prove it further).

He tells her to now read from Galatians 3:15-18: 

“15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man’s covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto.

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

At this point the man asks the woman.  “So, who’s the true seed of Abraham?”  

The woman responds: “Christ.”  She further agrees “Christ is the one seed, yes” after the man makes it clear that the seed to whom the promise was made is singular.

17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.”

The man refuting Zionism then tells the Pro-Zionist woman to go down a bit and read Galatians 3:26-29: 

“26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

The man asks her here: “Wait, there’s no longer Jew nor gentile?”  The woman responds “Yes.”  

The man then replies “So, why are you making a big deal about Israel over Palestine?”

The woman takes a deep breath at this point and says nothing.  The man asks her to read verses 26 through 28 again.  

He then asks her in regard to verse 29: “What are you if you’re in Christ?”

29 And if ye be Christ’s, then are ye Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.”

The man then asks her: “Wait, the seed of Abraham are believers in Jesus who are baptized into Jesus?”

The woman is having trouble but admits “Yes.”

The man refuting Zionism reiterates that the men and women who believe in Jesus are the sons and daughters of Abraham.  The woman again agrees.

The man then asks her again: “So why are you making a big deal about the State of Israel and taking their side against Palestine?”

It is shortly afterwards established that a Jew like Israel’s wicked prime minister Netanyahu who rejects Jesus Christ is not a true Jew in God’s eyes while a baptized Palestinian who loves Jesus is a true Jew in God’s eyes.  

After the woman admits this with no doubt, the man tells her that she has just destroyed her own case for being in favor of the State of Israel.

The woman replies, “You have to understand, this is a lot.”

The man responds, “I know it’s a lot, because you’ve been indoctrinated like I was.”  He goes on to basically say that we need to let the Bible speak for itself and teach us.

He then goes on to say that when Christ-rejecting Jews kill Palestinians, some of whom are believers in Jesus Christ, don’t tell me God is fighting for Israel.  He also goes on to talk about the foolishness of the thought that Jesus loves ethnically Jewish babies over Palestinian babies.  To believe that He does is to believe in another Jesus besides the Jesus of the Bible.

My note: I can’t emphasize too much how great this conversation summary is as a study tool.  Please look at it every now and then and reference it also as necessary.  This is a great way to (hopefully) put our studies on this topic to bed for now so we can better move onto other things.

Aaron’s email is: [email protected]

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